LONDON.- When Rufus Norris became the director of the National Theater in 2015, he said he had one main aim: to make the playhouse representative of Britain.
Almost a decade later and as Norris prepares to leave the role, he said he had made progress toward that goal, especially by prioritizing new works. Many of the theaters most acclaimed recent productions have centered people of color, including an adaptation of Andrea Levys Small Island, directed by Norris, about Caribbean immigrants to Britain.
On Tuesday, Norris, 59, unveiled a typically diverse final season, including Inter Alia, Suzie Millers follow-up to her hit legal play Prima Facie; Shaan Sahotas The Estate, about a British Asian politicians downfall; and a revival of Michael Abbensetts Alterations, about immigrants struggling to establish a tailoring business in 1970s London.
Norris will be hoping some of those shows transfer to Broadway, following National Theater hits including The Lehman Trilogy and War Horse.
In a recent interview, Norris said the demands of the job had meant he hadnt found time to reflect on his leadership. But an hourlong exchange gave Norris the opportunity to discuss his work at the National, the playhouses changing relationship with New York and his plans to step away from the theater world at least for a while. The conversation has been edited for length and clarity.
Q: British critics say youll be remembered for improving diversity at the National, something you achieved by setting targets. Where did that drive come from?
A: On a personal level, I grew up in Africa and Asia. My dad was a university lecturer who worked on those continents. I didnt grow up in a village in England somewhere where everybody looked the same.
And its called the National. It has been a frustration for generations that our theater culture has not reflected the country, and particularly London. I have a very deep-rooted belief that broadening the stories told just makes the arts richer.
Half the country are women, why arent half the writers? Its not a question of a lack of talent. So in a way, taking the job was an opportunity to build on what went before and really turn the dial up.
Q: What challenges did you face implementing the targets?
A: In a position like this, youre always going to get criticism. Institutions are there to lead, but also to throw stones at. And there was criticism from some quarters, people saying, You should just let the best artists put their best work on. Its not your responsibility to look further than that. And then from the other side: Why arent you doing more?
Now, diversitys just part of the conversation, and that conversation needed to and has become much more sophisticated. Its not just about heritage and gender, its also about disability or about class.
Q: During your time at the National, Britain has been deeply divided over issues like Brexit as well as widespread protests over the war in the Gaza Strip and in support of Black Lives Matter. What is the role of the National Theater in that environment?
A: Well, when Laurence Olivier (who led the theater from its founding in 1962) was asked what the National was for, he said, To make the audience applaud. And that remains true. Were here first and foremost for our audience, but hopefully theres been a bit more scrutiny of why the audience is applauding and who that audience are.
Over the last 20 years in Britain, weve seen a complete denigration of the arts in our school system so I think that cultural institutions like the National now have a huge role to play in upholding that role for the health of our society, and making sure that the dialogue is complex and sophisticated, that people are constantly invited to stand in the shoes of others and see things from a different perspective.
Q: After originating at the National, The Lehman Trilogy became a Broadway hit, but many of your shows have been very British tales, like Dear England, about soccer. Did you think about Broadway transfers?
A: I thought you were going to say that were too American. I mean, if you look at 2017s production of Angels in America, or Bryan Cranston in Network, or The Lehman Trilogy, theyre all American stories.
Its great that weve managed to maintain a presence on Broadway. But weve also had a huge presence in New York with shows at The Shed, Park Avenue Armory, St. Anns Warehouse and Playwrights Horizons.
The important thing is that were contributing to the culture there, in a way thats deep and profound. Were not just taking a show there to try and make money or fundraise.
So, with our new-work department, were constantly having American playwrights here, and its the same idea with our education work in America. Our NT Collection program, where schools can stream productions for free, now goes into 200 New York middle and high schools and we want another 100 per year over the next three years. Were lucky we have the ability to capture our work in a way that a lot of American theaters cant because of union rules.
Q: Whats your advice to Indhu Rubasingham, your successor?
A: Keep healthy.
Q: Have you had problems on that front?
A: No, not significantly. A long battle with smoking, which I finally got over. But I dont sleep well. And there have been periods when Ive been quite burned out. This is such a big job, youve got to be engaged at 8:30 in the morning through to 11:30 at night, when youre in here with a director after seeing a preview which needs radical work. And every day stuff comes out that youre not expecting.
Q: What will you do next? Nicholas Hytner, your predecessor at the National, went on to set up the Bridge, another theater alongside the River Thames. Will you do something like that?
A: No, Im going to have a year where I step away. I have been for a long time a chronic workaholic and its been exacerbated by this job so I need to get a grip on myself. Im going to get into nature for a bit and I will be doing up a cottage in Fife, Scotland, and getting in the sea.
Q: Will you be getting the props department to help you?
A: Well, actually, I worked in the building trade before I went into theater. But I am going to spend a little bit of time with our carpentry department before I leave, to hone up my skills.
This article originally appeared in
The New York Times.